Carnage/Combat stat weight spreadsheet online

[Lucifel]

(02-29-2012 12:02 PM)LagunaD Wrote:  The maximum rank of Force Charge is trainable at Level 49, not Level 50 like most other core abilities.

If you are using the StandardDamage value for Level 50 to predict the tooltup, instead of Level 49, that would account for exactly what you observe (a few points of non-scaling discrepancy).

(Deadly Throw is also Level 49, and Crippling Slash is Level 48, btw).

Yep, that did it. Thanks again!

[Lucifel]

I don't see Accuracy's over-cap defense reduction being taken in to account in this model. Am I missing something?

[LagunaD]

(03-01-2012 12:39 PM)Lucifel Wrote:  I don't see Accuracy's over-cap defense reduction being taken in to account in this model. Am I missing something?

Yes, it's there.

[Lucifel]

Just PM'ed you a draft of my expanded version.

[Kaedis]

Quote:Deadly Saber: predicted tooltip value is 2/3 of actual. Since it's a tick interval of 3 seconds, for a duration of 6 seconds, it's making me wonder if it has an initial tick at 0 too, but I can't see anything in the node viewer data that seems to confirm or refute this.

I tested this a while back, and it does have an initial tick, on stack application. Thus when you apply the first stack, it ticks immediately at 1 stack, then against at 3 seconds and a third time at 6 seconds. Applying another stack resets the tick timer, ticks immediately at the new stack, and will tick against 3 and 6 seconds later. This means you can theoretically gain a total of 7 ticks out of Deadly Saber: the initial and the 3 second 1-stack ticks, the initial and the 3 second 2-stack ticks, and all 3 3-stack ticks. This equates to a total equivalent of 5 ticks at 3 stacks, though it requires you to weave in 2 non-melee attacks over the course of the buff to prevent early clipping. Deadly Saber -> Melee -> Force -> Melee -> Force -> Melee will get you 7 total ticks, which is a 25% increase to the total damage done by the ability over simply casting Deadly Saber -> Melee x3.

Whether this is worthwhile or not I'll leave up to others.

[Lucifel]

(03-06-2012 01:54 PM)Kor Wrote:  

Quote:Deadly Saber: predicted tooltip value is 2/3 of actual. Since it's a tick interval of 3 seconds, for a duration of 6 seconds, it's making me wonder if it has an initial tick at 0 too, but I can't see anything in the node viewer data that seems to confirm or refute this.

I tested this a while back, and it does have an initial tick, on stack application. Thus when you apply the first stack, it ticks immediately at 1 stack, then against at 3 seconds and a third time at 6 seconds. Applying another stack resets the tick timer, ticks immediately at the new stack, and will tick against 3 and 6 seconds later. This means you can theoretically gain a total of 7 ticks out of Deadly Saber: the initial and the 3 second 1-stack ticks, the initial and the 3 second 2-stack ticks, and all 3 3-stack ticks. This equates to a total equivalent of 5 ticks at 3 stacks, though it requires you to weave in 2 non-melee attacks over the course of the buff to prevent early clipping. Deadly Saber -> Melee -> Force -> Melee -> Force -> Melee will get you 7 total ticks, which is a 25% increase to the total damage done by the ability over simply casting Deadly Saber -> Melee x3.

Whether this is worthwhile or not I'll leave up to others.

Just played around with the Annihilation rotation I made for the spreadsheet, adding one each of Force Scream and Smash for each cast of Deadly Saber to stretch tick uptime. It bumped the damage and empowerment procs from deadly saber noticeably, but wiped out any available GCDs for Vicious Slash and rage-starved the rotation to the point where it cut in to Annihilate and Rupture casts possible. My calculated dps dropped from 1164 to 1153. Using Force Choke to extend it when convenient might be worthwhile, but the long CD won't let that happen much. I'll play around a bit more to see if just adding Smash to extend it at least a little would be a dps gain, since with the right optional talents it's pretty nice damage per rage.

[Lucifel]

Okay, did further quick & dirty number-crunching to see if Smash to extend the 2-stack time of Deadly Saber is worthwhile. It looks like it is indeed a DPS boost, even without Quick Recovery. (Though this provides a good argument for taking QR.)

These numbers weren't even accounting for the extra Empowerment rage from more ticks, so it's a pretty pronounced gain, apparently.

[LagunaD]

(03-29-2012 04:15 AM)Lucifel Wrote:  Okay, did further quick & dirty number-crunching to see if Smash to extend the 2-stack time of Deadly Saber is worthwhile. It looks like it is indeed a DPS boost, even without Quick Recovery. (Though this provides a good argument for taking QR.)

These numbers weren't even accounting for the extra Empowerment rage from more ticks, so it's a pretty pronounced gain, apparently.

I tested this with my simulator, and it definitely agrees with your conclusion.

I used the stats from my Sentinel, who is in a mixture of Columi and crit crafted gear, and tweaked the stats to optimize them for Watchman/Annihilation. I use the Watchman priorities in the Compendium from this forum.

I use this skill spec for Watchman:

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#501bIbRrRMcGzZhrZh.1

(Some of the utility takents don't affect DPS, obviously, and I can't see why a Watchman/Annihilation spec wouldn't take Quick Recovery - the alternative in T1 is useless)

Without the Force Sweep "extender" I got 1174.5 +/- 0.2 DPS.

Adding "Use Force Sweep if target has 2 stacks of Overload Saber" to the priority queue (ahead of Cauterize) increases this to 1196.3 +/- 0.2 DPS.

That is almost a 2% increase overall, which is rather remarkable.

[Lucifel]

Any chance I can take a look at your simulator? I want to dig in to my annihilation work on the spreadsheet and see if it needs tweaks accuracy-wise. I've been hoping SimulationCraft-SWTOR would get up and running enough to start really number-crunching, but so far it looks like they still only have the inquisitor/consular classes implemented.

[Qed]

Hey LagunaD, I put together a Combat/Carnage simulator a-la my Trooper simulator here:
http://mmo-mechanics.com/swtor/forums/Th...w-approach .

Using identical stats in both the sheet and simulator, I get 1509 (sim) vs 1512 (spreadsheet), which makes me remarkably happy. It also gave me a chance to try out various rotation questions like, should you change ability usage while zen is up, etc. It did lead me to a questions though:

Where did you pull the ability data from for your calculations? I wanted to confirm the numbers that you used, but torhead seems wrong (eg: blade rush only has a single offhand attack) and I've had issues searching the sithwarrior database previously.

If you'd like to compare or stare or poke, I can link the code here or in it's own post.