Marksmanship Sniper/Sharpshooter Gunslinger Discussion 1.0-1.2

[LB_StorM]

I am working on a rotation simulator for a Marksman Sniper. It seems our energy consumption will be a rather complex issue to deal with. After toying around with it for a couple of hours, this is what I could come up with.

I built this based on a few assumptions.

• Sniper Volley is not good enough to warrant keeping it up at all times.
• We should strive to have 88 Energy or above at all times to maximize Energy regen.
• Trickshot > Speed Shot > Quick Aim Aimed Shot > Charged Burst
  

Charged Burst = Snipe
Aimed Shot = Ambush
Speed Shot = Series of Shots
Trickshot = Followthrough

(11-20-2011 09:57 PM)Falkenherz Wrote:  What do you think?

You're missing out on +30% crit damage, SoS buff, +4% Alacrity, and +6% Crit Rating. Are you sure it's worth it? By the way, is that for PvP or PvE? In general, Sustained > Burst in Operations.

[Falkenherz]

Well, all depends on how useful SoS actually will be. What I saw so far is that you require a lot of movement. A three-second channelled shot like SoS seems not the primary choice then. Explosive Probe with Cluster Bombs could compensate for the eventual missing damage. The tactics would be to take cover, burst all your energy out, and be on the move again while regenerating energy. This is a different tactics as a healing operative, who will try to uphold maximum energy throughout.

[LB_StorM]

I assume Series of Shots will be very useful, since considering that Marksmanship's tier 7 skill is all about Series of Shots, there's no way I'm playing a Marksman Sniper if my tier 7 skill is a waste. You actually don't require a lot of movement as a PvE Sniper, since we depend highly on cover. The cover system makes us highly immobile.

Your strategy faces a lot of downtime. Remember that for Operations, sustained DPS is king. How will you compete with a true Marksman Sniper if you spend 15 seconds doing nothing recovering Energy while he spends 15 seconds using auto-attacks and Trickshots? Specially considering that his Trickshots, Charged Bursts, and Series of Shots are stronger than yours, and your Explosive Probe isn't even as useful as a true Engineering Sniper's.

[woks]

(11-21-2011 01:26 AM)Falkenherz Wrote:  Well, all depends on how useful SoS actually will be. What I saw so far is that you require a lot of movement. A three-second channelled shot like SoS seems not the primary choice then. Explosive Probe with Cluster Bombs could compensate for the eventual missing damage. The tactics would be to take cover, burst all your energy out, and be on the move again while regenerating energy. This is a different tactics as a healing operative, who will try to uphold maximum energy throughout.

Noting also that AOE effect attack are likely to be less dps on a single ennemy than single target attack.

If you speak of clearing some trash mob your strategy might prove useful. But I wouldnt give up any of my 31 points from Marksmanship just so I can be champion of cleaning the way for others

[woks]

(11-20-2011 11:49 PM)LB_StorM Wrote:  

• Sniper Volley is not good enough to warrant keeping it up at all times.
• We should strive to have 88 Energy or above at all times to maximize Energy regen.
• Trickshot > Speed Shot > Quick Aim Aimed Shot > Charged Burst
  

Charged Burst = Snipe
Aimed Shot = Ambush
Speed Shot = Series of Shots
Trickshot = Followthrough

As far as Sniper Volley goes I had assumed too that it would not be worth it to try keeping it up. The buff duration is way too short and its only a 1/3 chance to get it.
Too complicated and waste of time to try to keep it up. Dont mind me I still am liking it has a dps proc effect.

I would like to know your opinion though. From your say it is highly recommanded to stay 88 energy and above. Thought DPS wise, best opening to a boss fight would look like:
Series of Shots > Rapid Fire + Series of Shots > Series of Shots > Ambush > Followthrough > Laze Target + Snipe > Snipe > Followthrough etc

Was the possibility of a burst of CD opening, taken in consideration when the Energy calculation has been made ? I understand however that at this moment you were comparing the sniper to the gunslinger and that you have yet to post the Sniper version.

[LB_StorM]

(11-22-2011 10:06 AM)woks Wrote:  I understand however that at this moment you were comparing the sniper to the gunslinger and that you have yet to post the Sniper version.

No, I wasn't comparing them. Sniper = Gunslinger as far gameplay. I just chose to use the Gunslinger in my calculations.

(11-22-2011 10:06 AM)woks Wrote:  I would like to know your opinion though. From your say it is highly recommanded to stay 88 energy and above. Thought DPS wise, best opening to a boss fight would look like:
Series of Shots > Rapid Fire + Series of Shots > Series of Shots > Ambush > Followthrough > Laze Target + Snipe > Snipe > Followthrough etc

I worked under the assumption that Followthrough is higher priority than Series of Shots. In that case, I would tweak the beginning of your rotation into SoS -> Rapid Fire + Trickshot -> SoS -> SoS -> Trickshot -> Ambush... If this assumption is wrong, then the beginning of your rotation is better.

The problem with the rest of your rotation in my opinion, is that the further down we go in Energy, the harder it is to bring it back up. Thus, each Blaster Fire (what I named the auto-attack) will recover say 7.2 or 5.4 Energy, instead of 9. That's the issue with Snipe. It eats up your Energy like nothing.

What I think is that we will always (or almost always) want to remain above either 88 Energy or 66 Energy. Going below that is dangerous territory for sustained DPS.

(11-22-2011 10:06 AM)woks Wrote:  Was the possibility of a burst of CD opening, taken in consideration when the Energy calculation has been made ?

I don't understand this question, sorry.

[woks]

I know that Gunslinger = Imperative as far as this goes, I didnt put a lot of time to study the gunslinger however and to me there could have been some slight differences between the 2. and I asked about it only because a difference like an energy cost of 1 more or less on a key ability would have change probably a lot. when you said "I am working on a rotation simulator for a Marksman Sniper. It seems our energy consumption will be a rather complex issue to deal with. After toying around with it for a couple of hours, this is what I could come up with."

Sorry for the other question, I may need to formule it in another way.

When you did the calculation/simulation of the Consumption using the abilities cooldown, You seems to have basicly go with the normal rotation, the one Gunslinger and Sniper will likely be using along the fight, you also took in consideration that you had to keep a high lvl of energy as you never go under 80 energy.

My question was more of a what if, as of what will happens when we burst our cd at the opening of the fight, How the energy pool and regeneration will react to this. You will want to use the CD and their effects as Fast as possible to maximize the amount of time you will be able to use those during the fight.

I dont know if it makes a little more sense to you that way. Pardon the way I speak, english is only my second language.

Really looking foward the other result you may come with during your other simulation and experience.

Also with your permission I was going to edit (well try to) your sheet into Imperial Sniper version, just so it reads easier for sniper players and I was going to share it with my guildmates.

[Kaladris]

You should keep in mind that it IS actually possible to burn a lot of energy by bursting at a boss and then regain 50 energy by using Adrenalin Probe, which has a 120 seconds CD, so it would be best anyway to use it as fast as we can to have it up as much as possible.

I think it is also clear that you should try to figure out one standart "energy-conserving-maximal-sustained-DPS" rotation and one for maximal Burst, which you could use whenever an energy restoring CD is ready.
The optimal action would be to coodinate your efforts!

So long,
Kala

[woks]

(11-22-2011 09:24 PM)Kaladris Wrote:  You should keep in mind that it IS actually possible to burn a lot of energy by bursting at a boss and then regain 50 energy by using Adrenalin Probe, which has a 120 seconds CD, so it would be best anyway to use it as fast as we can to have it up as much as possible.

I think it is also clear that you should try to figure out one standart "energy-conserving-maximal-sustained-DPS" rotation and one for maximal Burst, which you could use whenever an energy restoring CD is ready.
The optimal action would be to coodinate your efforts!

So long,
Kala

This Explain better thank you Kala

Also I was surprise to not see any account of takedown/ what ever the gunslinger counterpart is.

It is more than obvious that incorporating it to the rotation for the last 30% of the fight will change the game a lot for the energy consumption/conserving.

I guess though that it was a first draft since LB said he was "toying" with it. I'm sure we will see more indepth calculations from him in the future.

[Sol]

Hi woks, welcome to the forums =)

Firstly, your English is fine sometimes the question just needs a little explanation. Now to answer your question you will definitely ahve moments of high energy use for burst situation or for keeping high damage abilities on cool down. This is why they have given classes abilities like Adrenaline Probe that instantly restore energy/heat/ammo. This leads me to believe that you are correct. You will want to open up with your high cool down burst abilities, use your regen and settle into a normal rotation then repeat this again when your abilities come of cool down. This would be for a standard fight, however the principle is the same if you needed to save your burst for adds etc. You are going to be constantly juggling the need for energy conservation in the top tiers for faster regen, with times where you will be required to blow excess amounts for added burst.