Carnage | Discipline Discussion

[Winner]

Just a note:

I noticed that they patched "Surge" as to give diminishing returns.

Guess that means it used to be 'busted', but is now 'fixed'.


Also, I was curious. I'm more interested in PvP specs than PvE. But I didn't see anywhere any recommendations for what to use before 50, 45, 40, 35, 30, etc.

Obviously without Gore, there is an entirely different mindset as to what is good/bad/etc.

[clutch]

Couple of things i want to clarify.
PVP perspective. Full BM in the house lol like that means something right now.

I've been Anni spec for a while and i think it's better then carnage from just looking at it but want to try it out Even though i thought carnage was going to be better at the start.

Couple of questions here. Since surge nerf, I'm at 412 bonus damagae, 25% crit and 75% crit damage. My spec i would run.
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#1000cZuGbbddrRrsZMM.1

Questions, keep in mind this is for pvp.

1) With Gores 6 seconds, should 3 seconds be used with Ravage? You get two more attacks which one would be Force scream and the other would probbaly be massacare. Now is those 3 attacks better then say, four massacarers and a FS?

2) With Berserk, is it beneficial to actually use gore as you pop berserk and use 5 massacres and pull of a last FS before it drops? Or still use the ravage combo?

3) Seeing this is more of a stack rage and dump at once spec rather the Anni use as you have spec. You should only use gore when you have at least 10 rage. Is this still the case?

4) Rupture. Useful in pvp? Gut feeling says no for this spec since you want busrt rather then DoT. But have to ask.

Thanks, even though its the same class it will seem like a whole different world changing to see how it is.

[raiya1001]

I was wondering what the best trinkets for a Carnage spec Marauder is at endgame im currently using Burning Force Relic and Relic of Boundless Ages.

[stovepipe]

I assume by trinket you mean relic. I use the Matrix cube relic and the Champion crit/surge relic. I have the 20 second crit/surge relic macro'd to active with cloak of pain when I force leap.

IMO, I believe Carnage is better for PVP when you have good gear, before that, Ann. is better. Rage better for PVE.

In Carnage I like to go use Gore / ravage / Scream, when Berserk is up I make sure to have a full bar of Rage before I use it and then spam Mass. as I run in a circles around the player.

[Usu]

(02-19-2012 12:01 PM)raiya1001 Wrote:  I was wondering what the best trinkets for a Carnage spec Marauder is at endgame im currently using Burning Force Relic and Relic of Boundless Ages.

The answer is pretty obvious-any of the hm/nm Fabricator's proc relics(there is a relic called Plasma burst device in the databases, which should be ahead of others because of elemental damage type, but so far i or any of my guildmates dont saw any of them in the game.Maybee so much random, or just another datamined ghost)+rakata boundless ages if artificer, battlemaster boundless ages for others(just because there is simply no boss drop of the rakata-level use relic, only a columi with the 355 power).Some time ago i thought that two Fabricator's relics with diffirent damage types will work together, but no, tested two relics with diffirent damage types this weekend, with only melee attacks, the form turned off, every 3-4 gcd only one yellow number appeared, regardless one or two of them i was wearing.

[Dunadan]

(02-17-2012 10:07 AM)clutch Wrote:  Couple of things i want to clarify.
PVP perspective. Full BM in the house lol like that means something right now.

I've been Anni spec for a while and i think it's better then carnage from just looking at it but want to try it out Even though i thought carnage was going to be better at the start.

Couple of questions here. Since surge nerf, I'm at 412 bonus damagae, 25% crit and 75% crit damage. My spec i would run.
http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#1000cZuGbbddrRrsZMM.1

Questions, keep in mind this is for pvp.

1) With Gores 6 seconds, should 3 seconds be used with Ravage? You get two more attacks which one would be Force scream and the other would probbaly be massacare. Now is those 3 attacks better then say, four massacarers and a FS?

2) With Berserk, is it beneficial to actually use gore as you pop berserk and use 5 massacres and pull of a last FS before it drops? Or still use the ravage combo?

3) Seeing this is more of a stack rage and dump at once spec rather the Anni use as you have spec. You should only use gore when you have at least 10 rage. Is this still the case?

4) Rupture. Useful in pvp? Gut feeling says no for this spec since you want busrt rather then DoT. But have to ask.

Thanks, even though its the same class it will seem like a whole different world changing to see how it is.

1) if you have the massacre buff, yes. if not or if you have berserk up, no. ravage can proc blood frenzy which you will definitly want to have for the end of ravage when you use force scream (which also benefits from gore)

2) see 1. use berserk before you gore.

3) no, you only need 6 rage for a ravage with gore however the CD on ravage is longer than gore which means your next gore will probably be a berserk massacre spam. for that you need 9 rage (gore lasts 6 seconds, 1.5 is GCD, 4 1second massacres followed by FS). If you don't have berserk up and gore is up you will need 9 rage for Gore, massacre x2 and FS. In general however, it is most likely DPS neutral or close to use Gore without enough rage for 1 massacre because the damage on rage generation moves is generally about 2/3-3/4 that of rage spending moves so the actual loss in Dps would be the extra damage you would gain from AP at 100% attributed to that 1/4-1/3 extra damage which is not likely to be more valuable than using gore on CD. using one GCD for rage generation is probably better slightly, more than that is probably worse slightly.

4) no. unless you think a DPS smuggler is going to vanish away, its not worth it. Better would be to use your root saber throw/regular slow right before you think they'll vanish and then aoe slam.

[Daimonas]

Two quick questions:
1) Can ravage proc ataru form strikes (i'm almost sure it does, just need confirmation) and if yes how many chances does it get?
The animation looks like 1 hit from each saber (2 hits so far) then 1 hit with both sabers... Also damage comes in 3 "chuncks". Does that mean 3 chances to proc ataru?

2) Does gore benefit Force Scream? I.e. does armor reduce FS damage? I'm trying to compare between these two scenarios
(Assumptions for the sake of simplicity: not rage-starved and blood frenzy isn't up)

Scenario 1
0.0->1.5 -- Gore (4.5 sec gore buff remaining at the end, massacre buff not up, less chance for ataru)
1.5->3.0 -- Massacre (3.0 sec gore buff remaining at the end)
3.0-> 6.0 -- Ravage (Gore ends at the end)
6.0-> 7.5 FS (Gore-less)

Scenario 2
0.0->1.5 -- Massacre (No gore buff, starts a blood frenzy buff at 1.5 that will expire at 7.5)
1.5->3.0 -- Gore (4.5 sec gore buff remaining at the end)
3.0-> 6.0 -- Ravage (1.5 sec gore buff remaining at the end)
6.0-> 7.5 FS (should be a crit since Blood rage is still up until 7.5)

[LagunaD]

(02-22-2012 01:21 AM)Daimonas Wrote:  Two quick questions:
1) Can ravage proc ataru form strikes (i'm almost sure it does, just need confirmation) and if yes how many chances does it get?
The animation looks like 1 hit from each saber (2 hits so far) then 1 hit with both sabers... Also damage comes in 3 "chuncks". Does that mean 3 chances to proc ataru?

2) Does gore benefit Force Scream? I.e. does armor reduce FS damage?

1) According to the client files, it is 4 attacks.

2) Yes and yes.

[clutch]

Does Gore's attack ignore 100% armor since it's it applies as u use it and only get 3 attacks instead of 4?

[Ezmode]

From what I have seen, Gore does benefit from its debuff, and it does takeup 1.5 of the 6 seconds.