Immortal|Guardian PvE End Game Tanking Compendium - 1.2

[Sturrm]

(06-06-2012 02:18 PM)Omadon Wrote:  

(06-06-2012 06:45 AM)jamaal Wrote:  

(05-31-2012 02:15 PM)Omadon Wrote:  Hi. Long-time lurker here; big fan of all the work the contributors do on this site. I'd like to add something small to it if I may. My raid group is currently stuck on Zorn and Toth in Denova HM. We had a good run this past Tuesday and got them both under 10% multiple times, just couldn't quite seal the deal.

Anyways, we must've ran this same encounter for close to two and a half hours. Same mob, same group, roughly 4 mins of action each fight. So, I gathered up my combat logs and threw them into a Google doc.

https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B69sMoH...1NHbk1mV2s

It should be enough to make a pretty good sample, especially as each encounter is ceterus peribus (all things equal). I'm in a hybrid spec that I just started trying maybe 2 weeks ago (standard 17/22/2 with no Shien). I'm tempted to switch back to full Immortal just so we can compare the performance between the two builds via two large sample sets and constant groups (as I imagine we'll be stuck again for a while).

Please do what you all do with these combat logs. I intend to go through them myself over the weekend. I hope they help!

Omadon

Toth and Zorn. You will kill yourself if you Force scream and put a DOT on then get Fearful.

Thank you for the advice. I know the Fearful debuff reflects damage; but the DOT from Force Scream really isn't anything to write home about. It might crit for 65 damage on a single tick. I haven't seen it reflect enough damage on me to worry about it. And I usually try and cast FS right before they jump to proc the shield. Then it's Enraged Defense, Taunt, Saber Throw and Force Charge to get back into it.

Here's a cleaned up version of those logs on torparse. Wish I had found this before that first post. Oh well c'est la vie.

T&Z HM Logs Hybrid Jug

I'd love to see a full Immortal Jug's log for the same encounter. At the time I had 2 pieces of BH gear, rest full Rakata.

Listen to his help and read up on how fearful works. Fearful does not reflect damage, it hits you for a set amount. When discussing Lethality/Dirty Fighting snipers/gunslingers in this fight, the guys in that section of the forums verified this.

Quote:Zorn's fearful debuff is not a damage reflection. Every time you hit him you will take 6k damage. A tick for 330 damage will deal 6k to you. One auto attack will do 6k to you.
This is why they're bad for that fight.

Im sure you can do this fight without using Force Scream... but you might want to go back to full Immortal, since that spec does not have the DOT.

[Caeden]

Pretty much what Sturrm said. Fearful is a set amount per hit.

Dots are bad with fearful period. I have logs from this fight I think with full Immortal since that's what I have played since launch. That said, our progress has been greatly hampered lately due to summer.

[Caeden]

Quote: General

Rare instances where Unleash would not activate if the player wasn't facing the target have been corrected.


Juggernaut

Due to changes in the Juggernaut skill tree, Juggernauts have had their skill points refunded.
The amount absorbed by Sonic Barrier now scales properly based on character stats.
Soresu Form now generates 100% additional threat while active.

Vengeance
Single Saber Mastery now applies different effects based on your current Form. Shii-Cho Form now increases all Force damage dealt by 2% per point. Shien Form now increases all melee damage dealt by 2% per point. Soresu Form now increases melee and ranged defense by 1% per point and increases the threat generated by Smash and Sweeping Slash by 10% per point.

Immortal
Quake: Sweeping Slash now additionally applies this accuracy debuff to affected targets.
Blade Barricade: Retaliation now increases melee and ranged defense by 1% per point and lasts 12 seconds.
Unleashed has been replaced by Crushing Fist, which causes Smash to apply 2 stacks of armor reduction per point to all affected targets.
The damage dealt by Backhand has been reduced, but this ability no longer costs Rage to activate.
Crushing Blow has been slightly altered. The ability still applies 3 stacks of armor reduction. Damage dealt by this ability has been reduced, but when the target is affected by 5 stacks of armor reduction, Crushing Blow now deals damage to up to 2 nearby enemies, spreading 3 stacks of armor reduction to those enemies and knocking down Standard and Weak targets. It does not deal damage to sleeping, lifted, or incapacitated enemies, and continues to generate a high amount of additional threat.

Just the changes for Warriors that affect Immortal. Crushing blow is now more interesting and becomes a nice AoE rage dump and synergizes well with the updates to Smash via the new Crushing Fist.

Huge threat boost to Soresu Form and shows they're taking the WoW approach.

We will need to test Sonic Barrier.

[Ruul]

The wording on Crushing Blow is a bit ambiguous. Will it have that effect if Crushing Blow causes the target to get to 5 stacks or only if 5 stacks already exist on the target? That is, if the target has 2 stacks on them, then Crushing Blow is used which brings them up to 5 stacks, will that trigger the AoE? Or will it only happen on the second Crushing Blow?

Also, kind of curious about whether Crushing Fist is a one- or two-point talent. Hopefully, just one.

[zaios]

Looking ahead to 1.3 Full Augment Slots:

What are people looking at adding in their Augment slots come 1.3? I know this question will vary wildly depending on a persons own personal stats, but im curious to what ppl are thinking of running with along with a rough idea of their current stats.

Personally, fully raid buffed im sitting around:
94% Acc
24k Health
20% Def
50% Shield
50% Absorb

thats using the Rakata shells and full 61 mods in all slots bar my hilt (been giving DPS the weapons first up), with 2 augmented pieces (weapon + Boots) that currently have Shield Augments in them to get me to the 50% mark.

Should i be looking at stacking Def now? or maybe even health (small increase in chance to avoid all dmg vs health)? or should i push absorb or shield more even tho im hitting the major DR point on those stats?

Ive never been huge on stacking Stam in any game, but with stat DRs how they are in TOR, im guessing we will get to the point where we will get more bang for buck from stam vs DR'd secondary stats.

[Caeden]

With those stats, Defense seems the most logical stat to increase while maintaining the absorb/shield at 50/50.

Stam may become more important with EC nightmare in (presumably) 1.4.

[zaios]

(06-08-2012 02:36 AM)Caeden Wrote:  With those stats, Defense seems the most logical stat to increase while maintaining the absorb/shield at 50/50.

Stam may become more important with EC nightmare in (presumably) 1.4.

Cheers for the reply Caeden,

That was basically my train of thought, run with Def augments for now, and see what EC Nightmare requires when it comes.

[Rystet]

/agree with Caeden

At your Shield/Absorb level your incoming damage won't be to spiky.

Stacking Defense Augments will provide you with greater overall damage reduction. So, As long as you can keep the Shield/Absorb High to keep down damage spikes, go Def.

[zaios]

On the topic of Augments, i put together my version of a Tier 2, 1.3 BIS list for Jugg Tanks.

This can probably be tweaked to be improved more (ie the Sturdiness Enhancement gave 1 more pt of total stats vs the ones im using), but everything in this list is VERY easily accessible through Black Hole mods and/or Campaign Token Farming.

http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/character/ea...4632750c85
Add 2 more augment slots to belt/gloves, the site wouldn't allow me to put augments on the custom pieces yet

This build is stacking Def augments (bar 1 shield and 1 absorb to push both just over the 50% mark), if you stack Stam instead, you gain about 2k total Health, and lose about 5% Def

You can "farm" the Mods for each piece from:

(61) Advanced Guardian Armoring 26 - All our tank pieces, both Campaign and Black Hole, use Guardian Armorings.

(61) Advanced Elusive Mod 26B (Def) - Black Hole Helm, Campaign Boots
(61) Advanced Resilient Mod 26B (Absorb) - Campaign Helm, Campaign Legs

(61) Advanced Bulwark Enhancement 26 (Shield/Absorb) - Black Hole Chest, Campaign Gloves

[rancidious]

Hey, new here.

So i popped over to the PTS and this is what i found out.

1) crushing fist is a 2 pt talent
2) crushing blow only does it's aoe thing if there are 5 stacks of sunder on before the blow of crushing.
3) sonic barrier scales now here are the results

runnign mox while doing Black hole dailies (all absorbs were within 4-5 pts difference) and i had all 4 class buffs on (yay for alts) no stims or any other consumables.

edit: i only used force scream once per fight and only after they came out of stun from my smash, and did not kill any untill the barrier was down.

live:
naked (only my saber) 706
full gear no 4pc bonus 706
4pc bonus 846

pts:
naked 528
full gear no 4pc 790 edit: (also no matrix cube).
4pc 960
4pc without my matrix cube (accident) 950

my str/bonus damage/healing in these sets were:
naked: 437/273.4/111.4
no 4pc: 1654/643.1/195.8
4pc 1653/642.9/195.8
4pc no cube 1595/638.8/195.8

hopefully someone smarter than me can figure out this mumbo jumbo.

edit: if you need any more information i would be happy to find out.