[Archive] Sith Sorcerer/Jedi Sage Lightning/Telekinetics Compendium

[Archive] Sith Sorcerer/Jedi Sage Lightning/Telekinetics Compendium - Printable Version

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RE: Sith Sorcerer/Jedi Sage DPS Compendium - Pred - 12-06-2011 06:07 AM

Thing is, CT means you have 3 dots which makes you far more likely to make full use of the Deathmark talent's charges before you next cast Death Field.

RE: Sith Sorcerer/Jedi Sage DPS Compendium - Kaedis - 12-06-2011 07:38 AM

Assuming you cast Crushing Darkness right before Deathfield (as in, drop deathfield right as CD finishes casting), and assuming you're keeping Affliction active like you should, it's 100% guaranteed that all 10 stacks will be used within 8 seconds. CD alone will eat 8 stacks (if you've talented it), and Affliction will eat 3 during that time period, so it's a toss up which will get that 10th stack. That's all in an 8 second period, too, and Deathfield has a 15 second CD. Use it right, and CT is completely unnecessary for eating Deathmark stacks.

RE: Sith Sorcerer/Jedi Sage DPS Compendium - Pred - 12-06-2011 09:12 AM

Sorry I was assuming all dots tick like in WoW, every three seconds. Your post insinuates that one of ours is every second, which obviously changes things somewhat.

RE: Sith Sorcerer/Jedi Sage DPS Compendium - Alratan - 12-06-2011 09:15 AM

Correct - Crushing Darkness

Sith Inquisitor

Force: -40
Range: 10m
Activation time: 2.0 secs
Cooldown: 15 secs
Damage Type: Kinetic
Mirror: Mind Crush

Summons a dark cloud of energy to crush the target, instantly dealing [?] kinetic damage and an additional [?] kinetic damage over 6 seconds.

/ Mind Crush

Jedi Consular

Force: -40
Range: 10m
Activation time: 2.0 secs
Cooldown: 15 secs
Damage Type: Kinetic
Mirror: Crushing Darkness

Crushes the target's mind with the Force, instantly dealing [<1>] kinetic damage and an additional [<2>] kinetic damage over 6 seconds.

ticks every second.

RE: Sith Sorcerer/Jedi Sage DPS Compendium - Serpentis - 12-06-2011 10:11 AM

(12-06-2011 05:28 AM)Kore Wrote: ....
0/13/28

I played this hybrid build from lvl38 to 48 and als tried the "pure" telekinetics and balance with 31-pointer. This hybrid version was the best of all tested build but I played them with an minor change...

:: http://torguild.net/calculator/jedi-consular/sage/?p=000000000000000000032300020120000000003022302131201122300

I has not skilled the 6 seconds extended duration for "Weaken Mind" because I think the 15 normal seconds are fine. Instead I skilled the full 6% bonus for "Mind Crush". You need an 1.5 GCD every 15 seconds instead of every 21 seconds. The saved casting time is only minimal and it will bring the DOT's "out of sync".

Leaving "Weaken Mind" at 15 seconds you have 15 seconds CD on "The Force in Balance" and "Mind Crush" and 15 seconds runtime on "Weaken Mind". This allow an easy "rotation". You refresh "The Force in Balance" -> "Mind Crush" -> "Weaken Mind" every 15 seconds and use the instant procs for "Telekinetic Wave" or "Mind Crush".

All other things are mentioned.

(12-06-2011 05:28 AM)Kore Wrote: Open Questions
1. Is Deathfield worth casting?
2. Is Subversion worth casting Lightning Strike?
3. 3/3 Convection or 3/3 Electric Induction?
4. Is this build's output superior to 3/7/31?

1. I think yes. Its an good spell with an very high coefficient also for single target DPS. Its highter DPCT than the 3-second channeling and it boosts 10 DOT tinks on top of it.

2. I dont think so. You wont have any force problems and Lightning Strike/Disturbance are always worse than 3-second channeling FL/TT.

3. Get both.

4. Yes. I testet both and also deep telekinetics. The 3/7/31 is missing Lightning Barrage, which alone offsets the missing 31-pointer. And instant CL/TW are much better use of your instant proc than CD/MC. Additional you get 2 AE spells instead of one and normaly you can cast an instant CL/TW on CD.

(12-06-2011 07:38 AM)Kore Wrote: CD alone will eat 8 stacks (if you've talented it)

CD/MC are 7 ticks untalented and 9 ticks talented on my last tests. The first tick is at 0 seconds and the last tick after 6/8 seconds.

And if this still unclear... Presence of Mind/Wrath increase only the initial damage portion of CD/MC. The DOT tick damage is not increased. Therefore I prefer to use CL/TW on my instant procs.

RE: Sith Sorcerer/Jedi Sage DPS Compendium - Kaedis - 12-06-2011 02:55 PM

Lacking Disturb Mind (or it's Sorc equivalent Exsanguination) loses you 1.71 seconds of casting time per minute. That's a full channel of Force Lighting every 1.75 minutes. That's not an insignificant amount of damage you're losing there. Ease of rotation is arguable, but this forum is about min-maxing, not finding the easy rotation.

Quote:1. I think yes. Its an good spell with an very high coefficient also for single target DPS. Its highter DPCT than the 3-second channeling and it boosts 10 DOT tinks on top of it.

2. I dont think so. You wont have any force problems and Lightning Strike/Disturbance are always worse than 3-second channeling FL/TT.

3. Get both.

4. Yes. I testet both and also deep telekinetics. The 3/7/31 is missing Lightning Barrage, which alone offsets the missing 31-pointer. And instant CL/TW are much better use of your instant proc than CD/MC. Additional you get 2 AE spells instead of one and normaly you can cast an instant CL/TW on CD.

I should have been more clear. Most of those questions require mathematical analysis, not qualitative empirically-based theory. 1 and 3 are easy to prove mathematically, and as soon as I have a spare moment, I intend to analyze them. 2 is more complex and will require a simulator to truly test properly (though a statistical average could probably estimate the answer to a reasonable degree), and 4 is likely unanswerable until we know far more about gearsets at max level, and preferably have a fully functional sim. Still, I'm inclined to agree with your opinions for 1-3. 4, I'm still uncertain of.

Quote:CD/MC are 7 ticks untalented and 9 ticks talented on my last tests. The first tick is at 0 seconds and the last tick after 6/8 seconds.

The first tick isn't really a tick, it's a large damage spike. The first true tick occurs at 1 second in. It's possible that it still counts as a DoT, but it is not the same magnitude as the other ticks, and therefore I doubt it.

RE: Sith Sorcerer/Jedi Sage DPS Compendium - Sujin - 12-07-2011 03:08 AM

(12-06-2011 02:55 PM)Kore Wrote: It's possible that it still counts as a DoT, but it is not the same magnitude as the other ticks, and therefore I doubt it.

The initial direct damage does not count as a DoT. That direct damage is also the only part affected by a Wrath proc.

RE: Sith Sorcerer/Jedi Sage DPS Compendium - Lanfear1 - 12-07-2011 03:14 AM

(12-07-2011 03:08 AM)Sujin Wrote:
(12-06-2011 02:55 PM)Kore Wrote: It's possible that it still counts as a DoT, but it is not the same magnitude as the other ticks, and therefore I doubt it.

The initial direct damage does not count as a DoT. That direct damage is also the only part affected by a Wrath proc.

wow, you are 100% sure about this?

RE: Sith Sorcerer/Jedi Sage DPS Compendium - Sujin - 12-07-2011 03:46 AM

The first part of CD/MC is direct damage, whereas the the rest of it is a DoT. Both the direct damage portion and the DoT portion have separate coefficients and are coded separately in the XML.

Basically, this spell works like a damaging equivalent of the WoW Druid spell regrowth.

RE: Sith Sorcerer/Jedi Sage DPS Compendium - Lanfear1 - 12-07-2011 06:07 AM

And you are 100% sure that the direct damage is the only part affected by a Wrath proc?